Roma 32 32 Bit vs Dallas 32 Bit

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Monsieur Plastique
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Post by Monsieur Plastique »

I think it's been widely acknowledged that Lang was already finding it hard to improve his programs even in the late 80s, so close results in small statistically meaningful samples are not that surprising. Even if I take his current Windows Phone Genius and effectively slow it down to similar computational speeds that his late 80s Mephistos managed at classical tournament time controls, the strength is still quite close - maybe 30 to 50 points at best stronger than a Portorose.

I also recall reading (I may recall incorrectly), but the original Dallas to Roma evolution was considered to be an extremely small one.

It's all the more interesting that programmers like Morsch managed to make continued improvements right through his career- on the same hardware equivalents he probably squeezed a class and a half worth of improvements.
Chess is like painting the Mona Lisa whilst walking through a minefield.
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ricard60
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Post by ricard60 »

Monsieur Plastique wrote:
I also recall reading (I may recall incorrectly), but the original Dallas to Roma evolution was considered to be an extremely small one.
Probably yes, let´s see what happens.

In the second game came up this position

[fen]R7/4k3/8/6pp/5p2/6b1/4K3/8 w - - 0 1[/fen]

and after 65. Rh8 g4 66.Rxh5 went into a draw position.

Maybe a close match regards
Ricardo
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ricard60
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Post by ricard60 »

Fourth game at 20 sec/move was a queen opening and ended in a draw. In the end neither Roma or Dallas let the other king go through.
[Event "Computerschach"]
[Site"Mysticum"]
[Date "2015.09.01"]
[Time "19:32"]
[Round "4"]
[White "Dallas 32 Bit"]
[Black "Roma 32 Bit"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]

1.d2d4 d7d5 {Buch} 2.c2c4 Nb8c6 {Buch} 3.Nb1c3 Ng8f6 {Buch} 4.Bc1g5 Nf6e4 {Buch} 5.c4d5 {Buch} Ne4c3 {Buch} 6.b2c3 Qd8d5 {Buch} 7.Ng1f3 Bc8g4 {Buch} 8.Qd1b1 O-O-O {Buch} 9.e2e4 Qd5a5 {Buch/4_13} 10.Bg5d2 Bg4f3 {Buch/3_12} 11.g2f3 e7e6 {Buch/3_12} 12.Bf1e2 Bf8e7 {+00,00} 13.f3f4 g7g6 {+00,00} 14.Qb1b3 Qa5a3 {+00,00} 15.O-O h7h5 {+00,00} 16.Rf1b1 Nc6a5 {+00,00/4_13} 17.Qb3a3 Be7a3 {+00,00/5_14} 18.Rb1b5 b7b6 {+00,00/3_12} 19.Ra1b1 Rh8g8 {+00,00/3_12} 20.Be2d3 f7f6 {+00,00} 21.Rb1d1 a7a6 {+00,00} 22.Rb5b1 b6b5 {+00,00/4_13} 23.e4e5 f6f5 {+00,00/2_11} 24.Bd3e2 Rg8g7 {+00,00} 25.Bd2e3 Rg7d7 {+00,00} 26.Kg1h1 Rd7g7 {+00,00/5_14} 27.Rd1g1 Rg7g8 {+00,00/3_12} 28.Kh1g2 Na5b7 {+00,00} 29.Kg2f1 Nb7a5 {+00,00/5_14} 30.Kf1e1 h5h4 {+00,24/2_11} 31.Ke1f1 Kc8d7 {+00,24} 32.h2h3 Kd7c8 {+00,00} 33.Kf1e1 Kc8d7 {+00,00/4_13} 34.Be2f3 Kd7c8 {+00,00} 35.Rb1d1 Ba3b2 {+00,00/2_11} 36.Ke1d2 Na5c4 {+00,00/2_11} 37.Kd2c2 Bb2a3 {+00,00/3_12} 38.Rg1g2 Rg8g7 {+00,00/3_12} 39.Rd1g1 Rd8g8 {+00,00/4_13} 40.Bf3h5 a6a5 {+00,00/3_12} 41.Rg2g6 Rg7g6 {+00,00/2_11} 42.Rg1g6 Rg8g6 {+00,00/5_14} 43.Bh5g6 c7c6 {+00,00/5_14} 44.Bg6h5 Ba3e7 {+00,00/6_15} 45.Bh5e2 Nc4b6 {+00,00/3_12} 46.Be3d2 a5a4 {+00,00/4_13} 47.Bd2e3 Kc8d7 {+00,00/2_11} 48.c3c4 b5c4 {+00,00/2_11} 49.Kc2c3 Be7d8 {+00,00/6_15} 50.Be2c4 Bd8e7 {+00,00/6_15} 51.f2f3 Nb6d5 {+00,00/6_15} 52.Bc4d5 c6d5 {+00,00/8_17} 53.Be3f2 Kd7c6 {+00,00/4_13} 54.Bf2e1 Kc6b6 {+00,00/7_16} 55.Be1d2 Kb6b5 {+00,00/3_12} 56.Kc3d3 Be7a3 {+00,00/7_16} 57.Bd2e1 Ba3e7 {+00,00/6_15} 58.Be1c3 Be7b4 {+00,00/7_16} 59.Bc3b2 Bb4e7 {+00,00/7_16} 60.a2a3 Be7f8 {+00,00/4_13} 61.Kd3c3 Bf8e7 {+00,00/8_17} 62.Bb2c1 Be7f8 {+00,00/7_16} 63.Kc3d3 Bf8e7 {+00,00/7_16} 64.Bc1b2 Be7f8 {+00,00/5_14} 65.Bb2c1 Bf8e7 {+00,00/5_14} 66.Bc1b2 1/2-1/2


[fen]8/4b3/4p3/1k1pPp2/p2P1P1p/P2K1P1P/1B6/8 b - - 0 1[/fen]
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ricard60
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Post by ricard60 »

The 5th game at 1 mi/mov has taken place. Was a queen opening and black went for a slav defence used in a lot of books in dedicated chess machines.

[Event "Computerschach"]
[Site"Mysticum"]
[Date "2015.09.02"]
[Time "23:22"]
[Round "5"]
[White "Roma 32 Bit"]
[Black "Dallas 32 Bit"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]
[Result "0-1"]

1.d2d4 d7d5 {+00.00} 2.c2c4 c7c6 {+00.00} 3.Ng1f3 Ng8f6 {+00.00} 4.Nb1c3 e7e6 {+00.00} 5.Bc1g5 h7h6 {+00.00} 6.Bg5f6 Qd8f6 {+00,16/2_11} 7.e2e3 Bf8e7 {+00,20/2_11} 8.Bf1d3 Nb8d7 {+00,20/3_12} 9.O-O b7b6 {+00,20/4_13} 10.c4d5 e6d5 {+00,20/3_12} 11.Qd1c2 Bc8b7 {+00,20/4_13} 12.Nc3e2 g7g6 {+00,20/3_12} 13.Ra1b1 O-O {+00,28/2_11} 14.Rf1c1 Be7d6 {+00,45/2_11} 15.Ne2g3 a7a5 {+00,45/2_11} 16.e3e4 Bd6g3 {+00,45/4_13} 17.f2g3 d5e4 {+00,45/4_13} 18.Bd3e4 Rf8c8 {+00,45/3_12} 19.Rb1a1 Kg8g7 {+00,28/3_12} 20.Rc1f1 Qf6e6 {+00,28/4_13} 21.Rf1e1 Rc8e8 {+00,28/3_12} 22.a2a3 f7f5 {+00,12/2_11} 23.Be4d3 Qe6d6 {+00,12/4_13} 24.Ra1c1 c6c5 {+00,12/3_12} 25.d4c5 Nd7c5 {+00,04/2_11} 26.Qc2c3 Kg7h7 {+00,20/3_12} 27.Bd3b5 Re8e1 {-00,12/2_11} 28.Rc1e1 Ra8d8 {+00,00/3_12} 29.Qc3c4 Bb7d5 {+00,00/3_12} 30.Qc4d4 Nc5e6 {+00,00/3_12} 31.Qd4c3 Bd5e4 {+00,00/4_13} 32.Qc3c4 Qd6e7 {+00,00/2_11} 33.Re1c1 Qe7f6 {+00,00/3_12} 34.Qc4c3 Qf6c3 {-00,24/3_12} 35.b2c3 g6g5 {-00,24/4_13} 36.Bb5c4 Ne6c5 {-00,24/6_15} 37.Bc4b5 Nc5b3 {-00,80/3_12} 38.Rc1e1 Nb3d2 {-00,80/4_13} 39.Nf3d2 Rd8d2 {-00,80/7_16} 40.Re1e2 Rd2d1 {-00,80/5_14} 41.Kg1f2 Rd1c1 {-00,80/4_13} 42.c3c4 Rc1c3 {-00,80/5_14} 43.a3a4 Kh7g7 {-00,64/4_13} 44.g3g4 Kg7f6 {-00,64/6_15} 45.g4f5 Be4f5 {-00,80/4_13} 46.Re2d2 Rc3c2 {-00,80/6_15} 47.Rd2c2 Bf5c2 {-00,80/7_16} 48.g2g3 Kf6e5 {-00,80/5_14} 49.Kf2e3 Bc2g6 {-00,80/6_15} 50.h2h4 Bg6h5 {-00,60/5_14} 51.Bb5a6 Bh5g4 {-00,60/6_15} 52.Ba6b5 Bg4e6 {-00,60/6_15} 53.Bb5a6 Ke5d6 {-00,60/7_16} 54.Ke3d4 Be6f7 {-00,60/8_17} 55.Ba6b7 Bf7e6 56.Bb7a6 {-01,84/6_15} Be6f5 {-00,64/6_15} 57.Ba6b5 Bf5g6 {-00,64/7_16} 58.Bb5a6 g5g4 {-00,64/6_15} 59.Kd4c3 Kd6c5 {-00,55/6_15} 60.Ba6b5 Bg6f5 {-00,64/7_16} 61.Bb5a6 Bf5d7 {-00,68/7_16} 62.Ba6b5 Bd7b5 {-00,68/10_19} 63.c4b5 h6h5 {-03,36/10_19} 64.Kc3d3 Kc5b4 {-03,36/10_19} 65.Kd3d4 Kb4a4 {-03,36/10_19} 66.Kd4c4 Ka4a3 {-03,36} 67.Kc4c3 a5a4 {-03,36/11_20} 68.Kc3c2 Ka3b4 {-03,36/9_18} 69.Kc2b2 a4a3 {-04,12/10_19} 70.Kb2a2 Kb4a4 {-04,12/11_20} 71.Ka2a1 Ka4b5 {-05,16/11_20} 72.Ka1b1 Kb5b4 {-05,16/10_19} 73.Kb1a1 Kb4b3 {-09,99/10_19} 74.Ka1b1 b6b5 {+00,00/10_19} 75.Kb1a1 b5b4 {+00,00/11_20} 76.Ka1b1 a3a2 {-09,99/10_19} 77.Kb1a1 Kb3c2 {-09,99/11_20} 78.Ka1a2 b4b3 {-09,99/9_18} 79.Ka2a3 b3b2 {-09,99/7_16} 80.Ka3b4 b2b1=Q {-09,99/4_13} 0-1

Also was a very balanced game but in the ending and after move 62 came up this position:
[fen]8/3b4/1p5p/pBk5/P1P3pP/1K4P1/8/8 w - - 0 1 [/fen]

and after 62.. Bxb5 63.cxb5 h5 64.Kd3 Kb4 Roma is lost. Both machines at this point were looking 10 moves in brute force and 19 in selective search.
Dallas is up by 3-2 and one game to go.

Dallas and Roma regards
Ricardo
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ricard60
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Post by ricard60 »

This is the right fen after move 62.Bb5. After some minutes of posting the forum does not let me edit the last post anymore.

[fen]8/3b4/1p5p/pBk5/P1P3pP/2K3P1/8/8 w - - 0 1[/fen]

Fen regards
Ricardo
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ricard60
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Post by ricard60 »

In the sixth game and after 105 moves on the board came up this position

[fen]2N5/8/1p2knK1/2p5/8/8/8/8 w - - 0 1[/fen]

It looks like black (Roma) will win but white played 106.Nxb6, this move leads to a draw. As of course Dallas or Roma do not have EGTB i let them played up to move 150 and they got stuck in a position where black could not make progress with its pawn.

The match ended 3.5-2.5 for Dallas

[Event "Computerschach"]
[Site"Mysticum"]
[Date "2015.09.13"]
[Time "20:48"]
[Round "6"]
[White "Dallas 32 Bit"]
[Black "Roma 32 bit"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]

1.e2e4 {+00.00} e7e5 2.Bf1c4 {+00.00} Ng8f6 3.d2d3 {+00.00} Nb8c6 4.Ng1f3 {+00.00} Bf8c5 5.Nb1c3 {+00.00} d7d6 6.Bc1g5 {+00.00} h7h6 7.Bg5f6 {+00.00} Qd8f6 8.O-O{-00,08/3_12} Bc8e6 9.Bc4e6 {-00,12/2_11} Qf6e6 10.Nc3a4 {-00,12/4_13} Bc5b6 11.Na4b6 {-00,24/3_12} a7b6 12.a2a3 {-00,24/3_12} O-O 13.Qd1d2 {-00,24/3_12} f7f5 14.Ra1d1 {-00,24/3_12} f5e4 15.d3e4 {-00,24/4_13} Ra8a5 16.Qd2d3 {-00,20/3_12} Kg8h8 17.c2c3 {-00,28/2_11} Rf8f4 18.Nf3e1 {-00,16/3_12} Qe6a2 19.Rd1d2 {+00,00/3_12} Ra5a8 20.f2f3 {-00,08/3_12} Rf4f8 21.Qd3d5 {-00,04/3_12} Qa2d5 22.e4d5 {-00,04/4_13} Nc6a5 23.Ne1d3 {-00,04/5_14} Na5c4 24.Rd2e2 {-00,04/5_14} Ra8a5 25.Nd3b4 {-00,04/4_13} Ra5c5 26.Rf1f2 {+00,00/3_12} Kh8g8 27.Re2e4 {+00,00/6_15} b6b5 28.Re4e2 {+00,00/4_13} Rf8f6 29.Rf2f1 {+00,04/3_12} Rf6f5 30.Rf1e1 {+00,04/3_12} Kg8f7 31.Kg1f2 {+00,04/3_12} g7g6 32.Kf2g3 {+00,04/3_12} Nc4b6 33.Re1d1 {-00,16/3_12} Kf7g7 34.h2h3 {+00,00/3_12} Rf5f7 35.Rd1d2 {-00,28/3_12} Rc5c4 36.Rd2d1 {-00,32/4_13} Rf7f8 37.Nb4c2 {+00,00/3_12} Rc4f4 38.h3h4 {+00,00/4_13} Nb6c4 39.Nc2b4 {-00,32/3_12} Rf4f5 40.b2b3 {-00,32/4_13} Nc4b6 41.Rd1d3 {-00,32/3_12} Rf5f7 42.Nb4c2 {-00,32/5_14} Rf7f4 43.Rd3d1 {-00,36/3_12} Nb6d7 44.Rd1b1 {-00,36/4_13} Nd7f6 45.Re2d2 {-00,40/3_12} Nf6h5 46.Kg3h3 {-00,36/3_12} Rf4f7 47.Kh3h2 {-00,36/4_13} Rf8a8 48.Rb1f1 {-00,36/4_13} Rf7f6 49.g2g3 {-00,45/3_12} c7c5 50.Kh2h3 {-00,45/5_14} b7b6 51.Kh3g2 {-00,50/3_12} Rf6f8 52.Rf1b1 {-00,45/3_12} Rf8f7 53.c3c4 {-00,28/3_12} b5c4 54.b3c4 {-00,28/4_13} Ra8a6 55.Rd2d3 {-00,28/4_13} Nh5f6 56.Rd3b3 {-00,28/4_13} Nf6d7 57.Nc2e3 {-00,28/4_13} Rf7f8 58.Ne3d1 {-00,28/4_13} Ra6a4 59.Nd1b2 {-00,45/4_13} Ra4a7 60.Nb2d1 {-00,45/5_14} Kg7f7 61.Nd1c3 {-00,45/4_13} Kf7e7 62.Rb1e1 {-00,45/4_13} Rf8a8 63.a3a4 {-00,08/4_13} Ra8f8 64.f3f4 {-00,08/3_12} Ra7a6 65.Rb3a3 {-00,08/4_13} Rf8f5 66.Re1e4 {-00,12/3_12} g6g5 67.f4e5 {-00,45/4_13} Nd7e5 68.h4g5 {-00,45/5_14} h6g5 69.Ra3a1 {-00,45/5_14} Ke7d7 70.Ra1h1 {-00,36/4_13} Ra6a8 71.Rh1h7 {-00,36/4_13} Rf5f7 72.Rh7f7 {-00,36/4_13} Ne5f7 73.Re4g4 {-00,36/5_14} Ra8g8 74.Nc3b5 {-00,64/6_15} Nf7e5 75.Rg4e4 {-00,64/7_16} Rg8h8 76.Nb5c3 {-00,64/5_14} Rh8f8 77.Nc3b5 {-00,64/5_14} Rf8e8 78.Nb5c3 {-00,64/5_14} Re8h8 79.Nc3d1 {-00,92/5_14} Rh8a8 80.Nd1b2 {-00,60/5_14} Ra8f8 81.Re4e1 {-00,60/5_14} g5g4 82.Re1e4 {-00,60/6_15} Rf8f3 83.Re4g4 {-00,60/5_14} Rf3b3 84.Rg4g7 {-00,60/8_17} Kd7e8 85.Nb2d1 {-01,50/5_14} Rb3a3 86.Rg7h7 {-01,50/4_13} Ne5c4 87.Rh7h4 {-01,50/6_15} Ra3a4 88.Nd1c3 {-01,50/6_15} Ra4b4 89.Rh4e4 {-01,50/5_14} Ke8d8 90.Kg2h3 {+00,00/4_13} Kd8d7 91.Re4f4 {+00,00/5_14} Nc4e3 92.Rf4f7 {-01,64/5_14} Kd7c8 93.Rf7f3 {-01,64/5_14} Ne3g4 94.Rf3f4 {-01,64/6_15} Rb4f4 95.g3f4 {-01,64/8_17} Ng4f6 96.Kh3h4 {-01,64/7_16} Kc8d7 97.f4f5 {-01,64/7_16} Kd7e7 98.Kh4g5 {-01,76/6_15} Ke7f7 99.Nc3b5 {-01,76/7_16} Kf7g7 100.Nb5d6 {-01,76/6_15} Nf6d5 101.Nd6e8 {-01,76/8_17} Kg7f8 102.Ne8d6 {-01,84/7_16} Kf8e7 103.Nd6c8 {-01,84/6_15} Ke7d7 104.f5f6 {-01,84/7_16} Kd7e6 105.Kg5g6 {-01,84/7_16} Nd5f6 106.Nc8b6 {-01,84/7_16} Nf6e4 107.Kg6h5 {-04,88/7_16} Ke6d6 108.Kh5g4 {-04,80/7_16} Kd6c6 109.Nb6c4 {-04,80/7_16} Kc6d5 110.Nc4b6 {-04,80/7_16} Kd5d4 111.Kg4f5 {-04,80/7_16} Ne4d2 112.Kf5e6 {-04,72/6_15} Nd2f3 113.Ke6f5 {-04,72/6_15} Nf3h4 114.Kf5e6 {-04,72/6_15} Nh4g2 115.Ke6d7 {-04,84/7_16} Ng2e3 116.Kd7c6 {-04,84/6_15} Ne3f5 117.Kc6b5 {-04,84/7_16} Nf5d6 118.Kb5c6 {-04,76/6_15} Nd6c4 119.Nb6c8 {-04,80/7_16} Nc4e5 120.Kc6c7 {-04,80/7_16} Ne5d3 121.Nc8b6 {-04,76/6_15} Nd3f2 122.Kc7c6 {-04,60/6_15} Nf2e4 123.Kc6d7 {-04,60/6_15} Ne4f6 124.Kd7d6 {-04,68/6_15} Nf6h5 125.Kd6c6 {-04,68/8_17} Nh5f4 126.Nb6c8 {-04,68/7_16} Kd4c4 127.Nc8d6 {-04,68/9_18} Kc4b4 128.Kc6b6 {-04,68/6_15} Nf4g6 129.Kb6b7 {-04,60/6_15} Ng6e5 130.Kb7a6 {-04,60/8_17} Ne5f3 131.Ka6a7 {-04,64/6_15} Nf3d2 132.Ka7a6 {-04,76/6_15} Nd2b3 133.Ka6b7 {-04,76/7_16} Nb3d4 134.Kb7b6 {-04,76/6_15} Nd4e6 135.Kb6b7 {-04,50/6_15} Ne6g5 136.Kb7c6 {-04,50/8_17} Ng5f3 137.Kc6b7 {-04,55/6_15} Nf3g1 138.Kb7c6 {-04,55/9_18} Ng1e2 139.Kc6d5 {-04,55/7_16} Ne2c3 140.Kd5c6 {-04,55/7_16} Nc3b1 141.Nd6f5 {-04,45/7_16} Nb1d2 142.Nf5e3 {-04,45/6_15} Nd2b3 143.Kc6d6 {-04,45/6_15} Kb4b5 144.Kd6d5 {-04,45/6_15} Nb3d4 145.Ne3c4 {-04,40/6_15} Nd4c2 146.Nc4d6 {-04,40/9_18} Kb5b4 147.Nd6c4 {-04,40/7_16} Nc2e1 148.Nc4a5 {-04,40/7_16} Ne1d3 149.Na5c6 {-04,40/7_16} Kb4b3 150.Nc6e5 {-03,00/7_16} 1/2-1/2
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