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Weakest Dedicated Chess Computer
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compguy
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:39 pm    Post subject: Weakest Dedicated Chess Computer Reply with quote

After reading the recent post about the Novag Piccolo being rated in the 900’s. I was wondering what would be the weakest dedicated chess computer made?
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Steve B
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 4:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Weakest Dedicated Chess Computer Reply with quote

compguy wrote:
After reading the recent post about the Novag Piccolo being rated in the 900’s. I was wondering what would be the weakest dedicated chess computer made?


i guess that would have to be the very first dedicated chess computer ever sold..back in 1977
the Fidelity Chess Challenger ..i think its almost impossible to lose to it

<1000 Elo Regards
Steve
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compguy
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 5:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Weakest Dedicated Chess Computer Reply with quote

Steve B wrote:
compguy wrote:
After reading the recent post about the Novag Piccolo being rated in the 900’s. I was wondering what would be the weakest dedicated chess computer made?


i guess that would have to be the very first dedicated chess computer ever sold..back in 1977
the Fidelity Chess Challenger ..i think its almost impossible to lose to it

<1000 Elo Regards
Steve


You think the original Boris was stronger? It'd be interesting to see how many moves one of these earlier computers would last against a Revelation.
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Steve B
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 6:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Weakest Dedicated Chess Computer Reply with quote

compguy wrote:
Steve B wrote:
compguy wrote:
After reading the recent post about the Novag Piccolo being rated in the 900’s. I was wondering what would be the weakest dedicated chess computer made?


i guess that would have to be the very first dedicated chess computer ever sold..back in 1977
the Fidelity Chess Challenger ..i think its almost impossible to lose to it

<1000 Elo Regards
Steve


You think the original Boris was stronger? It'd be interesting to see how many moves one of these earlier computers would last against a Revelation.


Actually Selective Search Magaizine shows an old rating for the Boris of 1000
that would make it stronger then the CC1
playing a game on the CC1 was brutally painful due to the mistake in the notation
they corrected the error in the CC3 but the play was not all that much better

4b-4d Regards
Steve


Last edited by Steve B on Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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SirDave
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another 'powerhouse' that seems to show up frequently on the European eBay sites is the Novag Solo (elo circa 950).
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Steve B
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SirDave wrote:
Another 'powerhouse' that seems to show up frequently on the European eBay sites is the Novag Solo (elo circa 950).


The Wiki shows active chess ratings(30 minute games) for several of the weakest machines
it seems the weakest is the Novag Chess Champion 1.. barely tipping the rating scales at all.. with an abysmal 702
the Solo would eat that sucker for dinner...

scroll all the way down to the bottom
http://www.schach-computer.info/wiki/index.php/Wiki-Elo-Liste

Bottom Feeders Regards
Steve
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Cubeman
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Was the Novag Solo the same as the engine used in the Novag Escort? I had Novag Escort as my 1st ever chess computer and thought I was quite good when I was able to beat it on level 8, the painful thing in using it was that you could not force it to make a move so you just sat there getting hypnotized by the flashing LCD display.
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ricard60
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi cubeman,

Yes novag solo had the same engine as the novag escort did.

http://www.schach-computer.info/wiki/index.php/Novag_Escort

back to weakest elo regards
Ricardo
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, easily the weakest dedicated chess computer in my opinon has to be Novag's Disney Magic Castle.

It is probably even worse than Novag's Delta 1.

Regards

Nick
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is an example of Disney Magic Castle playing another candidate for the Title.

[Event "U1400 Green Stage 1 Group M"]
[Site "Active Chess 0:30/1"]
[Date "2008.05.14"]
[Round "12"]
[White "Yeno Travel Chess, LV 3."]
[Black "Novag Disney Magic Castle, LV 2."]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "C01"]
[WhiteElo "1300"]
[BlackElo "1100"]
[Annotator ""]
[PlyCount "79"]
[EventDate "2008.??.??"]
[EventType "tourn (rapid)"]
[EventRounds "18"]
[EventCountry "USA"]
[EventCategory "6"]

1. e4 {Novag Disney Magic Castle has no book} d6 2. d4 d5 {
Yeno Travel Chess out of book} 3. Nc3 e6 4. exd5 exd5 5. Bf4 Be6 6. Bd3 Be7 7.
Nf3 Nd7 8. O-O a6 9. Ng5 Bxg5 10. Bxg5 Qxg5 11. Qf3 Rd8 12. Nxd5 Qxd5 13. Qxd5
Bxd5 14. a4 Ne7 15. g3 O-O 16. Rfe1 Rfe8 17. c3 a5 18. c4 Be6 19. h4 b6 20. Re2
c6 21. b3 h6 22. f3 c5 23. Re4 cxd4 24. Rxd4 Ne5 25. Rxd8 Rxd8 26. Be4 Rd2 27.
f4 Nd3 28. Bxd3 Rxd3 29. b4 axb4 30. c5 bxc5 31. Kg2 Rd2+ 32. Kf3 Nd5 33. a5 b3
34. a6 b2 35. Re1 c4 36. a7 Rd3+ 37. Kf2 Rd2+ 38. Kf3 Rd3+ 39. Kf2 Rd2+ 40. Kf3
1/2-1/2


The Delta actually does have the ability to win.

[Event "U1400 Green Stage 1 Group K"]
[Site "Active Chess 0:30/1"]
[Date "2008.05.01"]
[Round "3"]
[White "Novag Delta 1, LV 30s"]
[Black "Mephisto America, LV 4."]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A00"]
[WhiteElo "1000"]
[BlackElo "1350"]
[Annotator ""]
[PlyCount "63"]
[EventDate "2008.??.??"]
[EventType "tourn (rapid)"]
[EventRounds "18"]
[EventCountry "USA"]
[EventCategory "6"]

{384MB, Hiarcs9.ctg, VAJO} 1. e3 e5 2. Nf3 e4 3. Ne5 f6 4. Qh5+ g6 5. Nxg6 hxg6
6. Qxh8 Nh6 7. Qh7 d5 8. Qxg6+ Nf7 9. f3 Nc6 10. a4 exf3 11. Bd3 Nce5 12. Qg3
Nxd3+ 13. cxd3 fxg2 14. Rg1 Ne5 15. d4 Nd3+ 16. Ke2 Nxc1+ 17. Rxc1 g1=Q 18.
Qxg1 Bf5 19. d3 Qd7 20. Nd2 Bg4+ 21. Nf3 Bxf3+ 22. Kxf3 Qf5+ 23. Ke2 Qh5+ 24.
Kd2 Bb4+ 25. Kc2 Qe2+ 26. Kb3 a5 27. Qg8+ Bf8 28. Rxc7 Qxd3+ 29. Ka2 Rb8 30.
Qf7+ Kd8 31. Rd7+ Kc8 32. Qe8# 1-0

The only two that I have sofar not been able to see winning a game are Novag Disney Castle and Fidelity CC1. But Fidelity CC1 compared to most of the really weak ones does play fairly ok up to a point.

Regards

Nick
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compguy
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the games Nick. The first one with the Novag Magic Castle is pretty bad. White tosses pieces and black falls into a draw. Evaluation code as major holes.
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Goren2
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2012 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scisys Travel Mate, followed closely by Sensor Computachess..
I bought it a week ago at a Flea market, and bought a Sensor computachess online that same day. I played them against each other 5 times so far, on weakest setting. Score:
Game 1: Travel mate loses a piece, then regains it, then goes on to slaughter everything except a pawn. It's up a queen a rook and like 5 pawns, and does a perpetual against the lone king +pawn. Of course neither computer recognizes the perpetual.
Game 2: Travel Mate gets mate in 1 (in 1/2 actually), and goes after computachess pawns. It ends up exchanging the queen for a pawn, and loses in like 50 moves.
Game 3: Travel mate with 2 pieces down gets mate in 1 again, doesn't do it, and loses in 50.
Game 4: Repetition again. Computachess gets mate in 1, but doesn't do it.
Game 5: I screwed up the imput, and didn't know how to take back. Was too tired to go through another random-move chess game.
Verdict: Both play so badly, that it's a miracle they were sold. Travel mate kinda sorta knows a bit of opening theory, and Computachess kinda sorta is more tactical. But missing mate in 1/2 for both is inexusable, and punishable by battery removal.

Ps, brand new collector. God I love chess computers. My tally so far (1 week of collecting)

Fidelity CC7 (In a black attache case, never used. Flea market, 11 Euro)
Radiophon Chess Master Diamond (Just bought it, 60E, used like once or twice)
Sensor Computachess (14E)
Novag Sensor 4 (Excellent condition, 8E)
Scisys chess Partner 3000 (7E)
Mephisto Micro Travel Chess computer (8E)
Millenium Karpov Shachpartner (I was stupid to buy it; really crappy design. 9E)
Mephisto Schachshule (9E)
Chess Champion Pocket Chess (9E)
Scisys Travel Mate (6E)

Total: 10 computers, price: 141 Euro.

Girlfriend getting worried how I'm to take those things to China (moving there in 3 months). I should be at about 30-40 computers by then...and if they're anything like the Diamond, I will be about 500KG overweight...
Cheers,
Goren
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Steve B
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2012 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome to the forum and to the great hobby of dedicated chess computers

not a bad start to your collection,,,and all for only 140 Euro
geez i spent more than that on my last computers shipping costs alone!
Razz

On The Road To China Regards
Steve
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2012 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On this topic of weakest chess computer. Here is one of the shortest games I have played under match conditions between chess computers.

[Event "U1400 Green Stage 1 Group N"]
[Site "Active Chess 0:30/1"]
[Date "2008.05.31"]
[Round "5"]
[White "Systema Computachess, LV 8."]
[Black "Excalibur Viper, LV C5."]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "C40"]
[WhiteElo "1200"]
[BlackElo "1300"]
[Annotator "Mind,Spacious"]
[PlyCount "12"]
[EventDate "2008.??.??"]
[EventType "tourn (rapid)"]
[EventRounds "18"]
[EventCountry "USA"]
[EventCategory "6"]

{Systema Computachess has no book} 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 {Excalibur Viper out of book
} d5 3. Nc3 dxe4 4. Nxe5 Qd4 5. f4 Bc5 6. Nb5 Qf2# 0-1

Only 6 moves, I have two more games with 6 moves. I wonder if anyone has any matches shorter than this?

And here is the Fidelity CC1 game against Fidelity Mini Chess Challenger.

[Event "U1400 Blue Stage 1 Group A"]
[Site "Active Chess 0:30/1 Hoover AL"]
[Date "2007.06.16"]
[Round "14"]
[White "Fidelity Mini Chess Challenge, LV 3."]
[Black "Fidelity CC 1, LV 1."]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "C25"]
[WhiteElo "1300"]
[BlackElo "985"]
[Annotator "Spacious Mind"]
[PlyCount "107"]
[EventDate "2007.02.01"]
[EventType "tourn (rapid)"]
[EventRounds "18"]
[EventCountry "USA"]
[EventCategory "6"]

1. e4 e5 2. Nc3 b6 3. h4 g6 4. d4 exd4 5. Bg5 f6 6. Qxd4 Nc6 7. Qd5 fxg5 8.
hxg5 Nge7 9. Qd3 Nb4 10. Qe2 Nec6 11. Nf3 Qe7 12. O-O-O Qc5 13. g3 Bg7 14. a3
Bxc3 15. bxc3 Na2+ 16. Kb2 Nxc3 17. Rd5 Nxd5 18. exd5+ Ne7 19. Qe5 O-O 20. d6
Nd5 21. Be2 cxd6 22. Qe4 Nc7 23. Bc4+ d5 24. Bb3 Qxf2 25. Bxd5+ Nxd5 26. Qxd5+
Kg7 27. Qxa8 Qxf3 28. Qxf3 Rxf3 29. g4 d6 30. Rd1 Bxg4 31. Rxd6 Rf5 32. Rd7+
Kh8 33. Rd8+ Kg7 34. Rd7+ Kh8 35. Rd8+ Kg7 36. Rd7+ Kh8 {
draw by repetition continued game like this:} 37. Rxa7 Rxg5 38. Kc3 Rc5+ 39.
Kd2 Rd5+ 40. Ke3 Re5+ 41. Kf4 Rf5+ 42. Kxg4 h5+ 43. Kg3 Rg5+ 44. Kf4 Rf5+ 45.
Ke4 Ra5 46. Rxa5 bxa5 47. c3 Kg7 48. a4 Kf6 49. c4 Ke6 50. Kd4 h4 51. c5 h3 52.
Ke4 h2 53. c6 h1=Q+ {Here CC1 moved the pawn to Queen.} 54. Kf4 {After this
e I had to give up the game as a draw CC1 in the previous move converted the
pawn to a Queen but I could not get the game to continue correctly.} 1/2-1/2

The game was officially a draw by repetition after 37 moves but I continued to play because I wanted to witness a match in which CC1 wins.



Unfortunately after CC1 moved the pawn to h1 on move 53, the game ended because CC1 refused to play any moves after this. Therefore promotion was not part of the game that it knows Sad

Best regards

Nick
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Dubliner
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spacious_mind wrote:
Well, easily the weakest dedicated chess computer in my opinon has to be Novag's Disney Magic Castle.

It is probably even worse than Novag's Delta 1.

Regards


Hello Nick,
Old post I know.
Even the delta 1 beats me.
Can you explain what button to the left of the 'new game' is for ( as I can not find the manual anywhere ) it looks like a hammer but it might be for castleing.
Love your web site.
Regards.
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